| 00:00:00 | Inventors and buys their
inventions and patents.
|
| 00:00:04 | His company holds more than
20,000 patents and every year
the company files 500 patent
applications.
|
| 00:00:11 | What we discussed was his
approach to and solutions for
global warming.
|
| 00:00:16 | I'm fascinated by his work
because I believe that global
warming is real, but I just
can't see the world coming
together to reduce co2 emissions
to the levels that will actually
stop it.
|
| 00:00:28 | I can't see china or india doing
it which in and of itself would
doom the project and I can't see
western countries making the
kind of drastic changes that
would be required to cut co2
emissions.
|
| 00:00:40 | If we did, there are still lots
of co2 in the atmosphere right
now and it will cause global
warming anyway.
|
| 00:00:48 | All of which made me want to
know, are there other approaches
and are there other strategies
we might pursue?
|
| 00:00:55 | In that spirit and in the wake
of the copenhagen spirit here is
a fascinating conversation and a
fascinating set of ideas,
concrete ideas to solve the
problem of global warming and
energy without going down the
copenhagen kyoto route or in
addition to going down the
copenhagen kyoto route.
|
| 00:01:14 | Nathan myhrvoid.
|
| 00:01:23 | >>> I am joined by nathan
myhrvoid.
|
| 00:01:27 | I have already introduced you,
but you have an unusual, unique
way of introducing yourself.
|
| 00:01:33 | I saw you do it at the
conference.
|
| 00:01:35 | Tell us the story about
penguins.
|
| 00:01:37 | >> So, I went to patgonia to
photograph wildlife.
|
| 00:01:42 | I was sitting in a hotel lobby
in patgonia trying to get
internet reception and editing
my photos in photoshop and this
woman came up to me and said,
that is beautiful, is that
jackson ponic.
|
| 00:02:02 | And I said, no, really, i
clicked and showed her the next
picture which kind of made it
very obvious that, in fact, this
is what it is.
|
| 00:02:11 | Penguins, it turns out have
amazing spinter muscles and
they're able to reject.
|
| 00:02:21 | I started looking online and, in
fact, I found there was a
scientific paper on exactly
this.
|
| 00:02:27 | In fact, it's the pressures
produced when penguins pooh and
they did modeling to understand
how much velocity to shoot that
stream out as far as it does.
|
| 00:02:42 | >> At this point she says --
>> she backs away and shaking
her head like, oh, my god.
|
| 00:02:47 | Who is this?
|
| 00:02:50 | >> Now, you've been spending a
lot of your time doing something
a little bit more serious
recently.
|
| 00:02:56 | You've been, you've been looking
into the issue of global warming
and you've brought all your
expertise and you're a trained
physicist and spent years at
microsoft and you understand the
science, the economics and what
is it that you, do you think
when you look at what is going
on what was going on in
copenhagen?
|
| 00:03:18 | >> Here's the real problem or
one of the pects of the
problem.
|
| 00:03:25 | When you emit co2 a good
fraction of it, maybe a little
bit more, will stay for
thousands of years.
|
| 00:03:32 | So, it's not like it goes up and
can go away after a little bit.
|
| 00:03:36 | As we continue to emit co2, it
continues to make the problem
worse and then even if we stop
cold turkey it will be there for
a long period of time.
|
| 00:03:44 | If you wanted a problem that was
almost perfectly designed to be
difficult for us to grapple
with, this would be it.
|
| 00:03:51 | Because the cost is very high,
the solution is going to require
a lot of sacrifice, but the
benefit is diffuse and global
and way out in the future.
|
| 00:04:04 | And that's the kind of problem
that humans are bad at.
|
| 00:04:08 | >> And that's why you have a
fundamental problem with the
idea, the whole approach of
limiting carbon emissions as the
solution to global warming.
|
| 00:04:17 | >> Well, I think that you have
to be incredible optimist or you
have to believe that it's not a
severe problem to think that
that's the only solution we
should investigate right now.
|
| 00:04:28 | Okay.
|
| 00:04:30 | This building has fire
extinguishers and a fire system,
but it's probably unlikely there
will be a fire today.
|
| 00:04:37 | Low probability event, but it's
important enough that we really
have to have all of this
infrastructure and alarms and
firemen that will race up here
and so forth.
|
| 00:04:49 | Because although it's low
probability, it's severe.
|
| 00:04:52 | In this case, we don't even know
what the probability is of how
severe it can be when there are
severe consequences and we also
don't know when we will get
around to getting serious.
|
| 00:05:04 | So, it seems to me that we need
to have a plan "b" and we need
to have a way to buy ourselves
some time if it starts getting
serious quickly.
|
| 00:05:14 | Now, what else could you do?
|
| 00:05:17 | The answer is a topic called
geoengineering which says can we
directly try to intervene?
|
| 00:05:23 | So, to use an analogy we all
know we're supposed to eat right
and exercise a lot and if we did
that, a lot of heart disease,
diabetes, tons of other diseases
we'd be better off.
|
| 00:05:35 | Turns out that is hard for
people to do.
|
| 00:05:38 | And as a result, you also have
interventions that you would do
like heart surgery that you
might do to get a stent put in
or to have a bypass operation
because, if you neglect the
problem long enough, that's what
you have to do.
|
| 00:05:52 | Well, the equivalent of that
surgery in this case are means
to directly intervene.
|
| 00:05:58 | Now, one approach is to take the
co2 and suck it out of the
atmosphere.
|
| 00:06:03 | How do you do that?
|
| 00:06:04 | We turn, actually, to benjamin
franklin.
|
| 00:06:08 | In 1783 there's a volcano called
locke in iceland, I've been
there to visit it that erupted
causing a tremendous winter in
1784 in the northern hemisphere.
|
| 00:06:22 | So, benjamin franklin gives a
paper and he says it was a
volcano.
|
| 00:06:26 | Well, we know today through lots
of --
>> how did he figure that out?
|
| 00:06:31 | >> He has a great, it's
wonderful thing, I wish I had
the text to read here because
it's in this sort of quaint
english of that era where he
says that it blocked the many
rays of the sun.
|
| 00:06:45 | And, so far as we know today,
ben was right.
|
| 00:06:49 | And we know this because in 1991
a mountain in the philippines
exploded.
|
| 00:06:56 | Lots of volcanoes since then,
but a very large volcano that
has a tremendous amount of power
would put a lot of gases and
particles into the very upper
atmosphere, stratosphere.
|
| 00:07:08 | It caused global temperatures to
drop by about 1 degree
fahrenheit for a year, year and
a half afterwards.
|
| 00:07:15 | Now, that's interesting because
that's about the amount of
global warming that we have
today.
|
| 00:07:19 | >> If you could just have it
every year.
|
| 00:07:25 | >> On demand would do it.
|
| 00:07:26 | >> What is it doing?
|
| 00:07:27 | What is the chemical process?
|
| 00:07:29 | It's spewing sulfur dioxide into
the upper atmosphere.
|
| 00:07:34 | Why is that good?
|
| 00:07:35 | >> So, when you have small
aerosole particles, light will
scatter off of them.
|
| 00:07:42 | That scattering is why one range
of that sense why the sky is
blue and another range of that
scattering is why milk is white,
actually.
|
| 00:07:51 | Turns out sulfur dioxide is very
good at scattering light and if
you have sulfur dioxide that
gives the rotten egg smell at
yellowstone or other places you
have geysers, enough of those
particles will scatter light.
|
| 00:08:08 | If you had a system for
delivering sulfur dioxide into
the upper atmosphere, you could
easily dim the earth by, dim the
sun by 1% and even do it in a
way that wouldn't be visible.
|
| 00:08:21 | >> So, how do you pump sulfur
dioxide into the atmosphere on
demand?
|
| 00:08:29 | >> LOADED INTO 747s AND CARRIED
Up are way too expensive.
|
| 00:08:34 | You need a cheap way to get a
lot of stuff up there.
|
| 00:08:37 | We set out to invent something
like that and we have come up
with a couple ways to do it, but
I'll tell you the simplest one,
which is you run a hose to the
sky.
|
| 00:08:47 | It sounds nuts, but you take a
hose and you suspend it on a
series of balloons, helium
balloons and you want to run it
25 kilometers up because it
takes you up into the
stratosphere.
|
| 00:09:03 | >> A 25 kilometer garden hose.
|
| 00:09:05 | >> Now, that's the interesting
part.
|
| 00:09:07 | If you go through a calculation
of how much you need, in our
best scheme, it's like a fat
garden hose.
|
| 00:09:14 | The total amount of rate that
you're pumping is about 30
gallons a minute.
|
| 00:09:19 | Okay, that's less than a
swimming pool pump.
|
| 00:09:24 | So, it's acxhael a very
manageable sized problem once
you come up with this idea that
you put the stuff up there.
|
| 00:09:31 | The best place to put it is in
very high latitudes.
|
| 00:09:35 | That's very far north or in the
southern hemisphere very far
north.
|
| 00:09:40 | So, northern canada, russia,
some place like that that's up
60, 70 degrees north.
|
| 00:09:45 | >> Run one of these garden hoses
at the north pole and one at the
south pole and turn them on
every year and you've solved the
problem of global warming?
|
| 00:09:56 | >> Well, we've done a series of
computer simulations that tell
us exactly that.
|
| 00:10:02 | That one of these units at 60 to
70 north will a s
assumptions on how you put the
aerosole up there will negate
global warming as we have it
today and putting it up there
will protect the arctic.
|
| 00:10:21 | Once you protect the arctic you
shut off a bunch of those
potential tipping point
mechanisms.
|
| 00:10:27 | Once you cool the arctic, you
draw enough heat from the rest
of the hemisphere that you bring
the rest of the hemisphere into
line and you don't have any
severe dislocations of the
weather.
|
| 00:10:38 | >> It's worth pointing out, your
stuff is all computer
simulations but, of course, so
are the predictions of the ipcc
model uses to predict very bad
stuff happening but if we
believe those computer
simulations there is no reason
to assume yours are wrong?
|
| 00:10:55 | >> Yes.
|
| 00:10:55 | We use the same kind of computer
simulations and the same kind of
software with some same kind of
assumptions.
|
| 00:11:03 | Neither one is perfect but it
gives us confidence and leaves
as much confidence as we would
have in the other directions.
|
| 00:11:09 | Of course, before you really
deploy it you want to run more
simulations and do small-scale
experiments and a lot to do to
build the full case, but from
what we can tell, this has
incredible promise.
|
| 00:11:24 | >> Are people, are governments
knocking on your doors?
|
| 00:11:26 | >> So, not so far.
|
| 00:11:28 | >> And we will be back with
nathan myhrvoid and more on
global warming and future energy
and a way to power the whole
world.
|
| 00:11:39 | >> What are we going to do and
while we're spending or talk
about spending hundreds of
billions and trillions even of
dollars trying to attack the
problem one way, shouldn't we do
some research and having a
backup plan?
|
| 00:11:52 | Build this wonderful big
building and forget the fire
sprinklers?
|
| 00:11:57 | It would be kind of silly.
|
| 00:14:33 | >>> Wree are back with nathan
myhrvoid chief financial for
microsoft.
|
| 00:14:45 | There is enough co2 put up in
the atmosphere that there is
going to be some global warming
even if we were to shut down the
economy today.
|
| 00:14:53 | >> India, china and the
developing world is where a huge
fraction of the emissions going
forward are going to be coming
from.
|
| 00:15:02 | They have a variety of arguments
as to why they shouldn't bear
the brunt of this.
|
| 00:15:07 | We emitted for all this period
of time and until their standard
of living is uours, we
shouldn't complain.
|
| 00:15:22 | Unless you do something by
force, which would be insane,
the fact is we're not making
progress.
|
| 00:15:29 | Now, if we don't make progress
but the problem isn't really all
that severe and we're at the low
end of that range so it's only a
degree or degree and a half then
maybe you don't need
geoengineering but if the
temperature starts climbing and
some of these tipping point
things start occurring.
|
| 00:15:46 | The gulf stream stops or the
greenland ice sheet collapses or
these methane, if any of those
things occur, what are we going
to do?
|
| 00:16:00 | And while we're spending or
talking about spending hundreds
of billions and trillions of
dollars trying to attack the
problem one way, shouldn't we do
some research in having a
back-up plan?
|
| 00:16:14 | You build this wonderful big
building and forget the fire
spripglers.
|
| 00:16:19 | It would be kind of silly.
|
| 00:16:20 | >> Do you think some part of the
opposition to doing a
geoengineering is, it doesn't,
it doesn't force us to kind of
make the painful adjustments.
|
| 00:16:33 | There is a sort of calvinist
feeling that we need to suffer
and what you're providing us
with is a way to have our cake
and eat it, too.
|
| 00:16:43 | >> I think there's a segment of
the environmental community that
has a pre-existing ideology and
anti-consumer and they have that
calvinist approach.
|
| 00:16:53 | They're anti-technaul.
|
| 00:16:54 | Hey, technology is how we got
and listening to guys like
nathan on technology is how we
got into this mess.
|
| 00:17:01 | If we're really this close,
maybe they'd have an argument.
|
| 00:17:05 | I don't think that suppressing a
potential solution, particularly
the only solution that could get
us out of a real pickle.
|
| 00:17:13 | The reason I say that is cutting
emissions to zero tomorrow won't
help us, "a," we couldn't do it.
|
| 00:17:21 | We absolutely couldn't do it
without totally wrenching
changes to everyone's life and,
frankly, killing lots of people.
|
| 00:17:29 | In the united states we cut back
on our energy use a fair amount
and we'd be okay, but you really
can't tell starving people to
cut back.
|
| 00:17:40 | There's no way to cut back
without it affecting starving
people.
|
| 00:17:44 | Another one of the things that i
think some of the folks in this
debate don't get is it's one
economy, you know.
|
| 00:17:52 | We've seen that in the course of
this last year where some guys
trading mortgage bonds wound up
almost causing a worldwide
depression because we're all
intralinked.
|
| 00:18:03 | If we drastically cut back the
economy in the developed world
by going to zero tomorrow,
there's no way that doesn't
affect the developing world and
no way that doesn't kill a lot
of people.
|
| 00:18:18 | That's just the blunt truth of
it.
|
| 00:18:20 | We don't have to cut to zero
tomorrow, well, okay, just, just
show me the first year where we
decreased at all.
|
| 00:18:28 | So far we're continuing to
increase, increase and increase
and I did a calculation recently
that in order to have co2 peak
in 40 years, which is the time
frame that many people say we
need to, we would need to cut
5%, 6% per
year every year for the next 40
years.
|
| 00:18:49 | Well, that means we have to do
it at least once.
|
| 00:18:52 | If we had one year where we're
6% down, maybe we've started.
|
| 00:18:56 | >> Or even 1% down.
|
| 00:18:57 | >> Because currently we're just
increasing.
|
| 00:19:00 | Increasing, increasing,
increasing.
|
| 00:19:02 | Until you can tell me that we're
on a path to this, I think it's
crazy not to explore these other
alternatives.
|
| 00:19:10 | But the controversy around it is
actually one of the reasons that
I'm bothering to talk to you.
|
| 00:19:15 | You know, this is an area where
I think geoengineering has to be
part of the debate.
|
| 00:19:24 | In a society of ideas in a
society that is a democracy in a
world where we're trying to
persuade people to do things, we
have to examine all these
different approaches.
|
| 00:19:34 | And if after lots of examining
we discover it's not a good idea
for some reason.
|
| 00:19:40 | What if there's an unintended
consequence.
|
| 00:19:43 | Well, okay, but what if we have
run away warming and 9 degrees
fahrenheit, then what do we do?
|
| 00:19:49 | The trouble is you can't rule
these things out prematurely.
|
| 00:19:56 | But for many scientists and for
many others interested in this,
it's kind of a third rail issue.
|
| 00:20:02 | The reaction is so strong and so
negative that it requires a
tremendous amount of very thick
skin in order to talk about it
publicly.
|
| 00:20:15 | >> Weyou surprised?
|
| 00:20:20 | What was your reaction to it?
|
| 00:20:23 | >> I don't know it was a
conspiracy and I don't know
there was anything wrong done
but it sure as hell was a blow
to how people view the
reliability of the field.
|
| 00:20:35 | And what it's going to mean is
that climate scientists
everywhere, I think, are going
to have to approach this
reproducible results thing.
|
| 00:20:44 | They're going to have to go the
extra mile to be transparent
because the world's a little bit
dubious now.
|
| 00:20:52 | >> We will be back with nathan
myhrvoid in a moment.
|
| 00:20:56 | >> By making venture capital
easy, we created companies that
have changed the way we live.
|
| 00:21:01 | But for inventions, no one does
that.
|
| 00:21:04 | Okay.
|
| 00:21:04 | There's no one that funds
inventors.
|
| 00:21:06 | Well, this chevy cobalt xfe has better highway
mileage
>>> I'm back with nathan
myhrvoid and one of america's
great scientist inventors.
|
| 00:24:05 | One of the things I have been
worried about over the last few
months is looking at new studies
of innovation.
|
| 00:24:13 | A lot of the studies of
innovation and where it is
happening I discovered were
SURVEYS BASED ON ASKING CEOs OR
Scientists where do you think
the best place is for innovation
and then there are some new
studies out with hard data and
the data suggests that while the
united states is clearly at the
top of the field, the gap is
closing.
|
| 00:24:34 | That there are more places, even
in europe and certainly now in
china, south korea, singapore.
|
| 00:24:41 | When you look at this field,
where do you see innovation
happening?
|
| 00:24:45 | >> Well, the first, no question
that india and china and the
developing world is made
enormous strides.
|
| 00:24:54 | So, there's all these statistics
about how many engineers are
being graduated in india or
china.
|
| 00:24:59 | Now, I used to be when those
engineers graduated the first
thing they wanted to do was come
to the united states --
>> probably work for you at
microsoft.
|
| 00:25:08 | >> One of the first things we
did at microsoft was went on a
recruiting trip to india and
hired a bunch of people and
ultimately started a research
lab in india.
|
| 00:25:18 | It, increasingly, as those
countries develop, they don't
to do their
graduate work or really start
their companies.
|
| 00:25:26 | They stay home.
|
| 00:25:28 | is
clearly not going to have the
preeminent position that it used
to have.
|
| 00:25:34 | Now, some people view that with
great alarm.
|
| 00:25:38 | The way I view that is to say,
look, we ought to continue to do
better.
|
| 00:25:41 | We have to make sure we don't
kill the goose that is laying
the golden egg.
|
| 00:25:45 | But I can't say it's a bad thing
that china and india develop.
|
| 00:25:51 | You know, the, there's some kind
in a molecular biology class in
china or india who 20 years from
now may discover the drug that
saves my life.
|
| 00:26:05 | How bad should I feel about
that?
|
| 00:26:07 | The thing we learned in the
course of the last 20 or 30
years is that the pace of
technology increases the pace of
technology.
|
| 00:26:15 | That the more you have good,
smart people doing things, the
faster everything moves along.
|
| 00:26:20 | >> Explain what your company
does because you have been very
sleek chairicture as being a
patent troll sitting around
buying and accumulating every
scientific patent you can.
|
| 00:26:34 | What have you come up with or
acquired?
|
| 00:26:37 | >> Our company has a basic idea
which is we want to invest in
invention.
|
| 00:26:41 | And we think that if the world
invested in invention, you'd get
a lot more inventions, which
means as a subset of that, a lot
more good inventions.
|
| 00:26:53 | We'd like to use venture
capitalism analogy.
|
| 00:26:55 | Over the course of the last 30
years, venture capital has grown
enormously.
|
| 00:27:01 | Factor 50 to 100 depending on
how you measure it.
|
| 00:27:04 | So, if you went back 50 years
ago and you said where is the
venture capitalests, you would
discover we didn't need them.
|
| 00:27:13 | We don't need them, we have
plenty of companies.
|
| 00:27:16 | Why do we need venture
capitalism?
|
| 00:27:22 | >> For people to develop a new
company.
|
| 00:27:24 | The venture capital world has
developed everything.
|
| 00:27:28 | Imagine a world without apple,
cisco and intel, those are all
venture-backed companies.
|
| 00:27:34 | We created companies that have
changed the way that we live.
|
| 00:27:37 | But for inventions, no one does
that.
|
| 00:27:40 | Okay.
|
| 00:27:40 | There's no one that funds
inventors.
|
| 00:27:44 | The invention is sort of the
poor stepchild to all of
technology.
|
| 00:27:48 | People sort of assume, oh, yes,
they'll have an invention and
then go to the v
capitalist.
|
| 00:28:00 | That is very nice, sir, and show
you the door.
|
| 00:28:02 | We have a lobby full of guys
with ideas, but not great ideas.
|
| 00:28:06 | Our company is about investing
in inventions.
|
| 00:28:14 | Sometimes we invest in
inventions we create our selves
and sometimes we invest in
inventions.
|
| 00:28:18 | We think if we create a business
model where we are successful
doing this there will be a
category of folks called venture
capitalists, that's what we call
our selves, that will give
increasing money.
|
| 00:28:31 | The reason the venture capital
world has grown so much is
because people want to make a
buck.
|
| 00:28:37 | They have incentive to do it and
not just the venture capitalists
but the pension fund guy who is
thinking about how he tries to
make a return.
|
| 00:28:47 | He's willing to risk some
capital and that dynamic has
created the technology economy
we have today.
|
| 00:28:54 | We think we need to take it to
the next level by investing
directly in invention.
|
| 00:29:00 | >> Pleasure to have you on.
|
| 00:29:02 | >> Thank you.
|
| 00:29:03 | >> We will be right back.
|
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tightness in mychest came back-
I knew I had tosee my doctor.
|
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|
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|
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Within 15 minutes.
|
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| 00:29:37 | Symbicort containsformoterol.
|
| 00:29:38 | Medicines like formoterolmay increase the
chance
of asthma-related death.
|
| 00:29:42 | So, it is not forpeople whose asthma
is well controlled onother asthma medicines.
|
| 00:29:45 | See your doctor if yourasthma does not improve
Or gets worse.
|
| 00:29:49 | I know symbicort won'treplace a rescue inhaler.
|
| 00:29:51 | Within 15 minutessymbicort starts
to improve mylung function
and begins totreat my symptoms.
|
| 00:29:56 | That makes symbicort agood choice for me.
|
| 00:29:59 | You have choices.
|
| 00:30:00 | Ask your doctor ifsymbicort is right for
you.
|
| 00:30:02 | (announcer)IF YOU CANNOT AFFORD YOUR MEDICATION,
Astrazeneca maybe able to help.
|
| 00:30:08 | Okay, now here's our holiday gift list.
|
| 00:30:10 | Aww, not the mall.
|
| 00:30:11 | .. if you do the
shipping.
|
| 00:30:14 | Shipping's a hassle.i'll go to the mall.
|
| 00:30:18 | Hey.
|
| 00:30:18 | Hi.
|
| 00:30:19 | You know, holiday shipping's easy with priority
mail
flat rate boxes fromthe postal service.
|
| 00:30:23 | If it fits, it ships anywhere in the country
for a low flat rate.
|
| 00:30:26 | Yea, I know.
|
| 00:30:29 | Oh, you're good.
|
| 00:30:30 | Good luck!
|
| 00:30:31 | Priority mail flat rate shipping starts at
95
only from the postal service.
|
| 00:30:35 | A simpler way to ship.
|
| 00:31:24 | How's your daughter, manny?
|
| 00:31:26 | Good.
|
| 00:31:27 | We were just going over prescription drug
plans.
|
| 00:31:29 | Medicare, huh?
|
| 00:31:30 | (Manny) UMM-HUH.
|
| 00:31:31 | I'm there next year.
|
| 00:31:32 | Yeah, every year during open enrollment
I can review my plan.
|
| 00:31:35 | Mine still works for me.
|
| 00:31:37 | Now how 'bout a plan for up here?
|
| 00:31:41 | (whistles) UH-UH.
|
| 00:31:44 | (announcer) NOW'S THE TIME TO REVIEW
Your medicare prescription drug and health
plans.
|
| 00:31:48 | Visit medicare.gov or call 1-800-medicare.
|
| 00:31:55 | úúúçú
>>> now, for our what in the
world segment.
|
| 00:32:19 | What got my attention this week
was this photograph, which
inspired this one and this one
and this one and this one and
perhaps thousands more.
|
| 00:32:31 | Why are all these men dressed
like women?
|
| 00:32:33 | The first photograph you saw is
of majid a student protester in
iran and last week as a national
day of protest against the
iranian regime he gave this
rousing speech urging his fellow
students to reject tyranny and
stand up against what he called
a dictatorship.
|
| 00:32:54 | Shortly thereafter he was
arrested and shortly after that
iranian news agencies which are
all tied to the regime released
these pictures of him wearing a
traditional woman's head
covering.
|
| 00:33:09 | He tried to escape arrest by
dressing like a woman.
|
| 00:33:14 | His fellow opposition members
say, nonsense.
|
| 00:33:16 | They claimed the iranian police
dressed him in a particular way
and released pictures
feminize him and in solidarity,
men from across iran and from
around the world has been
dressing them selves the same
way taking pictures and
uploading them to the internet.
|
| 00:33:40 | Technology has been a great
friend of iran's green
revolution.
|
| 00:33:43 | It allows us the word to know
and see what is happening inside
the country.
|
| 00:33:48 | It allows us to even join in on
protests in cases like these.
|
| 00:33:53 | government has now
recognized this and this week
the obama administration
notified congress that it has
begun the process to remove
sanctions currently in place
that prohibit people in iran
from downloading american-made
software for instant messaging,
chat software.
|
| 00:34:15 | But the controlled militia is
trying to stay one step ahead.
|
| 00:34:19 | Putting in a division of
cyberpolice to keep an ever more
vigilant watch on what is said,
done and transmitted from iran.
|
| 00:34:28 | Iran has been investing in
repression.
|
| 00:34:31 | When the opposition tries to
march in the streets, it is
literally beaten back.
|
| 00:34:37 | When they speak out, as we have
seen here, they are silenced by
arrest.
|
| 00:34:40 | When they try to organize, they
are thwarted.
|
| 00:34:43 | That's why I think the protests
and protests like this one
gather great good will for the
good green movement around the
world and I wonder whether they
will ultimately be affected
internally and whether they're
achieving their goal of
unseating president ahmadinejad.
|
| 00:34:58 | I spoke recently with a
frenchman who is distinguished
professor in paris and he told
me he holds the green movement
in great esteem.
|
| 00:35:13 | But, he said, it lacks
leadership.
|
| 00:35:17 | Let's remember leadership can
make all the difference here
turning a protest movement into
a revolution.
|
| 00:35:23 | Think of gandhi, king, mandela.
|
| 00:35:26 | Meanwhile, there are reports
that he is now in solitary
confinement in iran's notorious
evan prison.
|
| 00:35:36 | We'll be right back.
|
| 00:35:38 | >> The muslims will change the
way they look at religious
values, at social values, at
political values if they are
integrated in the same manner to
the global economy that
wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww
>>> hello, I'm fredricka
whitfield in atlanta with these
stories.
|
| 00:38:51 | The major airports are slowly
reopening as well and stranded
travelers are beginning to move
again, ever so slowly.
|
| 00:38:58 | The storm dropped up to two feet
of snow in the mid-atlantic
states before hitting new york
and new england.
|
| 00:39:04 | >>> So, let's check in with
meteorologist bonnie schneider
in the cnn weather center with
more on this storm.
|
| 00:39:11 | Bonnie?
|
| 00:39:11 | >> Fred, you mentioned the air
travel being crippled by the
snow storm and now one runway
opened at both airports in
, that's not
that much.
|
| 00:39:20 | For those of you still trying to
get out in newark, new jersey,
05 and lengthy
delays, no doubt, in
philadelphia.
|
| 00:39:28 | Let's take a look at what is
going on with the storm right
now and you'll see that the
advisories and the warnings we
had have now expired.
|
| 00:39:35 | That's some good news.
|
| 00:39:36 | However, we are still watching
the threat for more snow in
northern new england.
|
| 00:39:41 | We still have advisories posted
for flood watches along the
cape.
|
| 00:39:48 | Winter advisories will continue
until 5:00 today.
|
| 00:39:51 | Boston, still more snow and
still strong wind and all the
way down to the rhode island
coastline and even into clip
rhode island and connecticut.
|
| 00:39:59 | The storm is not done yet.
|
| 00:40:02 | We will have problems where it
is not snowing with visibility
due to strong wind.
|
| 00:40:08 | All right, let's go live now to
NEW YORK's LaGuardia airport.
|
| 00:40:11 | Susan candiotti is standing by.
|
| 00:40:15 | Susan?
|
| 00:40:15 | >> Outside here the sun is
shining and the runways are open
AT JFK, LaGUARDIA AND NEWARK.
|
| 00:40:21 | But inside, look at these lines.
|
| 00:40:23 | It stretches from one end to the
other.
|
| 00:40:25 | People all trying to get to the
ticket counters and at the end
of this line it even snakes
around the corner.
|
| 00:40:30 | Many people standing in line
here for about three or four
hours that very least and that's
because between yesterday and
today at least 800 flights have
been canceled.
|
| 00:40:41 | In the city, plows are out and
trying to dig out from
underneath.
|
| 00:40:45 | At least nine or ten inches of
snow and same in the
metropolitan area.
|
| 00:40:49 | Some getting up to two feet of
snow.
|
| 00:40:52 | New york city and the region
trying to dig out in order for
people to get home for the
holidays.
|
| 00:40:57 | Fred, back to you.
|
| 00:40:58 | >> Susan candiotti and bonnie
schneider.
|
| 00:41:01 | Thank you very much.
|
| 00:41:02 | The other major story we're
following is health care reform.
|
| 00:41:06 | The senate resums debate at this
hour.
|
| 00:41:08 | A sweeping overhaul bill.
|
| 00:41:09 | The democrats have already
locked in the 60 votes needed to
overcome a republican filibuster
and the first in a series of
votes is scheduled for monday.
|
| 00:41:19 | 1:00 A.m. eastern.
|
| 00:41:19 | Be sure to join tom foreman and
dr. sanjay gupta.
|
| 00:41:23 | They will lead our special
coverage tonight beginning at
midnight.
|
| 00:41:27 | Our coverage takes you right up
to the key vote.
|
| 00:41:30 | >>> And those are the top
stories.
|
| 00:41:33 | We'll return to fareed zakaria
"gps" in a moment.
|
| 00:44:42 | >>> From the chaos in
afghanistan to the middle east
peace process most involves
radicalism and violence.
|
| 00:44:50 | There is a much wider muslim
world out there and in his new
book vali nasr argues that
they're fighting extremists with
a new tool.
|
| 00:45:00 | Capitalism.
|
| 00:45:01 | Esteem scholar of islam in the
middle east and adviser to the
obama administration on pakistan
and a frequent guest on this
program.
|
| 00:45:09 | His new book is called "fortune
of forces, the rise of the new
muslim middle class and what it
"
we recommended it a couple weeks
ago.
|
| 00:45:17 | Welcome back.
|
| 00:45:17 | >> Thank you.
|
| 00:45:20 | >> Perhaps the central point
that you're trying to make in
your book, if you think about
the world that we all live in, a
world of increasingly
globalization and structures of
governance and there's a kind of
value system underlaying it and
lots of people feel that the
islamic world doesn't seem to
share the values of the west or
the advanced world or the
industrialized world.
|
| 00:45:46 | And why do you think that this
is true?
|
| 00:45:49 | Why is there this divide?
|
| 00:45:51 | >> What is very important about
the muslim world is that large
parts of it are not included in
the global economy in any real
way.
|
| 00:45:58 | In other words, they're not part
of the supply chain of
globalization production
investment and the farther away
they are from it, the more
they're shielded from these
global valus and we tend to see
more tendency towards extremism,
fundalmentalism and extreme
attitudes.
|
| 00:46:16 | In some ways the muslims have
not been subjected to the kind
of pressures that market forces
bring to bear on people to
change their values and world
view so that they can live in
harmony with global markets and
main stream of global politics
and culture.
|
| 00:46:31 | >> Now, what's interesting, in
your view, a lot of people say
the way you should change the
muslim world is you need to have
debates between theologians and
the moderates to stand up or we
need an islamic, why is that not
that heart of the issue?
|
| 00:46:49 | >> Because ideas only get
traction if people have vested
interests in them.
|
| 00:46:53 | I don't think that we're going
to change the muslim world by
one side winning a debating
contest of us convincing them
that they have to have a better
sense of different things and
change their values.
|
| 00:47:06 | I think where we've seen
positive developments in the
muslim world in turkey and
molasha and indonesiana since
the bali bombings has become
antiextremist as a country,
people are developing interests
in more moderate values.
|
| 00:47:22 | In values --
>> there's an incentive, almost
money to be made to put it
crudely in being moderate and
being modern and main stream.
|
| 00:47:31 | >> In fact, that's the way it
happened in the west.
|
| 00:47:34 | The affirmation was, leaders
were more like the taliban than
the sort of liberal values we
have with -- what the markets
did, the rise of capitalism as
david hums said, it calms the
edges.
|
| 00:47:58 | When you look at the world and
you look at china, india, the
west.
|
| 00:48:03 | A shared belief and vested
interest in the global economy
working and benefitting
everybody and a large part of
the muslim world doesn't have an
interest in the global to sale, seems
to be a lot of western products,
the malls, they have all the
western technology.
|
| 00:48:21 | Why is that not -- aren't they
in a sense, part of the
globalized world?
|
| 00:48:27 | >> Well, not in the right way.
|
| 00:48:28 | In saudi arabia, you don't have
a private sector and
entrepreneur class.
|
| 00:48:37 | In saudi arabia, the wealth
comes from oil.
|
| 00:48:40 | It's in the hands of the
government.
|
| 00:48:42 | It is not produced by markets,
but by government, then handed
down through entitlements.
|
| 00:48:51 | So an average business man is
not producing things we buy at
walmart as opposed to tur kish.
|
| 00:49:02 | So, there is no vested interest
in harmony with the rest of the
world.
|
| 00:49:08 | You do see that in indonesia and
turkey.
|
| 00:49:14 | It comes from that whole
capitalist mechanism.
|
| 00:49:18 | >> So the places you see
changed, turkey, malaysia,
>> dubai, because they created a
new regulatory framework to
allow muslims from everywhere
else to go acting as
entrepreneurs, but as middle
classes that want to consume the
results of their wealth.
|
| 00:49:50 | In other words, on vacations,
shopping, having a good life.
|
| 00:49:54 | It showed that the muslims will
change the way they look at
religious values, at social
values, political value, if they
are integrated into the same
manner that brazilians or
indians are.
|
| 00:50:12 | What made dubai such a popular
place for muslims, other than
their own country is not because
it has got a lot of islamic
mosques, but because it's a
cross between disney land and
las vegas.
|
| 00:50:28 | The wealth comes from below, you
have a middle class, their
consumption preferences are like
everybody else.
|
| 00:50:37 | >> You make a quote in the book
where you quote a business man,
what I love about dubai is that
I can have first class meals and
hotels, but then go to an air
conditioned mosque, even pray in
luxury.
|
| 00:50:54 | It accommodates religion while
at the same time las vegas and
disney land.
|
| 00:51:01 | >> We look at turkey for
instance, the up and coming
middle class and entrepreneur
class, the an tole yan tigers,
which have been behind the
growth of the economy, you can
see they are very religious, but
they're interested in religion
as values, not political action.
|
| 00:51:24 | It's a lot more like the
religious of middle america.
|
| 00:51:30 | It is not directed at revolution
and war and social action, but
is much more about personal
priority.
|
| 00:51:40 | It's the kind of piety that's
procapitalism rather than social
justice.
|
| 00:51:55 | So, we're not going to see
secularism.
|
| 00:51:56 | >> So, this is all sounding very
hopeful.
|
| 00:51:57 | What do you make of all these
people kind of new conservatives
saying europe is turning into
urabia, fundamentalism is still
on the march.
|
| 00:52:14 | Are they really not seeing the
real muslim world?
|
| 00:52:19 | >> No, they're only looking at
one trend, which as dangerous as
it is, it's not the only trend.
|
| 00:52:27 | They're not looking how other
trends defeat fundamentalism.
|
| 00:52:37 | They've got the process
backward.
|
| 00:52:39 | They think the muslim world
should first give up on
religion, then modernize.
|
| 00:52:48 | The lesson of the west is that
you first modernize.
|
| 00:52:51 | So even if they want the muslim
world to have a different kind
of islam, whether it is, it's
not going to happen unless you
have the same force that changed
the west is unleashed in the
muslim world.
|
| 00:53:07 | >> The book is optimistic, are
you?
|
| 00:53:09 | >> I find things about the
muslim world are not
unchangeable.
|
| 00:53:13 | I think the problem is that the
right kind of dynamics doesn't
exit in the muslim world and i
think we've got it wrong by
thinking the problem is tural
and religious.
|
| 00:53:28 | If you get this right, there is
no reason that larger parts of
the muslim world cannot be like
latin america or southeast asia.
|
| 00:53:36 | >> Pleasure, as always.
|
| 00:53:37 | "
we will be right back.
|
| 00:55:31 | oo@o
>>> Now for our question.
|
| 00:57:11 | Last week, I asked you about the
climate gate controversy.
|
| 00:57:15 | Those e-mails british scientists
may have discounted evidence
against global warming.
|
| 00:57:20 | I asked you if it made you doubt
whether the planet was getting
warmer.
|
| 00:57:25 | The vast majority said you still
believe global warming is
happening.
|
| 00:57:31 | Nancy nolan wrote -- lisa turner
of el paso, texas believes that
climate is a vast complex system
that cannot be altered in a
single generation and questions
why so many have jumped on the
band waggen.
|
| 00:57:52 | She writes -- now for this week,
I will not be asking you a
question because I think we
should rest our brains because
of the holiday, but I do want to
recommend a book.
|
