| 00:00:00 | Im
before he can be convicted?
|
| 00:00:04 | Do you consider yourself
qualified to vote in this
country?
|
| 00:00:06 | Can you answer that question?
|
| 00:00:07 | Want to hear it again?
|
| 00:00:09 | If a person is charged with
treason and denies his guilt,
how many persons must testify
against him before he can be
convicted?
|
| 00:00:18 | How about this one from the same
test?
|
| 00:00:21 | In what year did the congress
gain the right to prohibit the
migration of persons to the
states?
|
| 00:00:27 | Do you know the answer to that
one?
|
| 00:00:30 | Again, these are from alabama's
literacy test in 1965.
|
| 00:00:35 | It was applied selectively of
course to black voters to keep
them from registering.
|
| 00:00:40 | If you lived in georgia in 1958,
you would have faced questions
like this one.
|
| 00:00:44 | Who is the solicitor general of
the state judicial circuit in
which you live and who is the
judge of such circuit?
|
| 00:00:50 | If such circuit has more than
one judge, name them all.
|
| 00:00:53 | How did you do on that one?
|
| 00:00:54 | How about this one?
|
| 00:00:55 | What does the constitution of
georgia provide regarding the
suspension of the writ of habeas
corpus?
|
| 00:01:01 | If you wanted to vote in georgia
in 1958 those are the questions
you would have to answer.
|
| 00:01:07 | But of course not everyone would
face those questions.
|
| 00:01:10 | The board of registrars had the
sole authority to determine who
got asked which literacy test
questions and whose answers to
those questions rendered them
ineligible to vote.
|
| 00:01:20 | The idea was that black voters
weren't being denied the right
to vote based on race.
|
| 00:01:24 | That would be illegal.
|
| 00:01:26 | No, those voters just couldn't
pass this literacy test.
|
| 00:01:30 | This isn't the plot of some
kudzu and klansman gothic short
story.
|
| 00:01:39 | This isn't a theoretical for
first-year law students.
|
| 00:01:41 | This isn't some state
department report on some tin
pot dictatorship halfway around
the world we can't pronounce.
|
| 00:01:46 | This is american history.
|
| 00:01:47 | This is really, really recent
american history as in this
lifetime for a lot of people
american history.
|
| 00:01:53 | And the opening night speech at
the national tea party
convention this weekend proposed
bringing the literacy test for
voting back.
|
| 00:02:03 | And that proposal got a warm
round of applause.
|
| 00:02:07 | >> Mostly because I think we do
not have a civics literacy test
before people can vote in this
country, people who cannot even
spell the word "vote" or say it
in english put a committed
socialist ideologue in the white
house.
|
| 00:02:47 | The name is barack hussein
obama.
|
| 00:02:51 | >> Whiplash wake-up point here
is not that somebody with a
record like tom tancredo would
suggest something like this.
|
| 00:02:59 | He's made a living out of
this schtik for sometime.
|
| 00:03:02 | What is important here is that a
suggestion like that would be
greeted with cheers from an
american crowd.
|
| 00:03:05 | Hey, let's go back to the ways
we used to keep black people
from voting in this country.
|
| 00:03:10 | >> Mostly because I think we do
not have a civics literacy test
before people can vote in this
country.
|
| 00:03:26 | >> Tom tancredo, what an idea!
|
| 00:03:29 | The crowd cheering the proposed
return to literacy tests for
voting.
|
| 00:03:36 | A the day after tom tancredo's
speech, one of the convention's
organizers was asked his
response to this proposal.
|
| 00:03:45 | >> What do you think the message
is when you're saying obama
voters cannot pass a basic
civics literacy test?
|
| 00:03:55 | It.
|
| 00:03:55 | >> Well, you know, tom tancredo
gave a fantastic speech last
night.
|
| 00:03:58 | I think he's an amazing
politician.
|
| 00:04:01 | >> Amazing, yes.
|
| 00:04:02 | The tea party crowd that cheered
the proposed return to literacy
tests, literacy tests used for
70 years to keep black americans
from voting, also hosted sarah
palin as the event's keynote
speaker.
|
| 00:04:14 | >> The republican party would be
really smart to start trying to
absorb as much of the tea party
movement as possible because
this is the future of our
country, the tea party movement
is the future of politics.
|
| 00:04:24 | >> The future.
|
| 00:04:27 | ON SEPTEMBER 12th, 1895, THE
"New york times" reported on the
state of south carolina's
attempts to suppress the black
vote.
|
| 00:04:36 | The article was titled "negroes
must be barred.
|
| 00:04:39 | White supremacy demanded by the
"
among the things south carolina
was considering to preserve
white supremacy to prevent black
people from voting was something
they called the mississippi
plan, a plan which, quote,
requires an educational
qualification consisting of the
ability to read or understand
any section of the constitution
of the state.
|
| 00:05:00 | Such ability to be determined by
the registration commissioners.
|
| 00:05:03 | The "new york times" explained
at the time -- again, this is
1895 -- that the result would
wholly abolish the negro
majority and any immediate fear
of it.
|
| 00:05:15 | And of course that's exactly
what happened.
|
| 00:05:17 | Literacy tests were how
african-americans were kept from
voting in this country for some
70 years.
|
| 00:05:21 | This isn't ancient history.
|
| 00:05:23 | The alabama test I quoted from
before?
|
| 00:05:25 | That's from 1965.
|
| 00:05:27 | These tests were one of the main
targets of the voting rights act
pushed by president lyndon
johnson that same year.
|
| 00:05:37 | >> The harsh fact is that in
many places in this country men
and women are kept from voting
simply because they are negroes.
|
| 00:05:49 | Every device of which human
ingenuity is capable has been
used to deny this right.
|
| 00:05:59 | He may be asked to recite the
entire constitution.
|
| 00:06:04 | Or explain the most complex
provisions of state law.
|
| 00:06:11 | And even a college degree cannot
be used to prove that he can
read and write.
|
| 00:06:22 | Well, the fact is that the only
way to pass these barriers is to
show a white skin.
|
| 00:06:28 | >> President johnson later
signed into law a bill that he
hoped would prevent what he
called the systemic and
ingenious discrimination of
literacy tests for voting.
|
| 00:06:42 | There are african-americans who
are members of congress today
who were not during their
lifetimes allowed to vote
because of literacy tests for
voting.
|
| 00:06:53 | Now the tea party movement is
applauding a proposal to bring
literacy tests for voting back
and they are shocked and
horrified to be called racist
for doing so.
|
| 00:06:57 | Joining us now is harvard law
professor charles ogletree
director of harvard university's
charles hamilton
institute for race and justice.
|
| 00:07:07 | Thank you so much for joining us
on the show tonight.
|
| 00:07:08 | >> Thank you, rachel.
|
| 00:07:09 | Happy to be with you.
|
| 00:07:09 | Happy new year.
|
| 00:07:10 | >> Thank you.
|
| 00:07:12 | Let me ask you first if I have
fairly characterized the use of
literacy tests in america as a
tool for denying people the
right to vote.
|
| 00:07:22 | >> You've only understated it.
|
| 00:07:23 | I mean, you talk about all types
of poll taxes and literacy
tests.
|
| 00:07:28 | My pastor, reverend adles had to
tell the poll watcher how many
marbles were in a jar, hundreds
of
marbles, and had to get the
number right.
|
| 00:07:42 | All of these questions were
designed to keep blacks from
voting.
|
| 00:07:46 | But what tancredo said is
remarkable.
|
| 00:07:49 | If you're talking about literacy
tests, are you saying those
people did not have the right to
exercise one person, one vote?
|
| 00:07:55 | I think it's part of using the
buzz words literacy
I think it's part of thinking of
using the buzz words, literacy
test, that implies blacks
because blacks have been denied
that right.
|
| 00:08:09 | I think tom tancredo needs to
read the constitution and think
about what he means because
there are a lot of black, white,
and brown citizens all over
america who have worked very
hard to earn the right to vote
and to tell them they are not
capable, he is wrong.
|
| 00:08:16 | They lost the election in 2008.
|
| 00:08:17 | Get over it.
|
| 00:08:18 | It's time to live in 2010.
|
| 00:08:19 | >> On that issue of the
legitimacy of president obama's
election, about his, the
questions about his eligibility
for example.
|
| 00:08:25 | I was thinking about this today
with reading all the reporting
about how much the whole
birtherism birth certificate
issue won't go away for this
president either.
|
| 00:08:35 | And I wonder if the idea is that
it's not possible for barack
obama to be president unless
something's gone horribly wrong
with the system that checks
credentials and that okays
people for voting and for high
office.
|
| 00:08:52 | Is that in flekted by race?
|
| 00:08:55 | >> It is.
|
| 00:08:55 | And the reality is that
president obama's done a
remarkable job coming into a
presidency with two wars and
with the economy in the tank and
had he's tried to overcome that
with a lot of great plans and
ideas like the stimulus package
and even bailing out wall street
which kept us from going into
the great depression and trying
to get health care.
|
| 00:09:12 | The reality is that there are
people who still don't want him
to be president because he's
doing things they don't like.
|
| 00:09:18 | So race becomes a dividing issue
but he is not going to let race
become a burden or barrier to
him accomplishing his goals as
president.
|
| 00:09:24 | What's important about all of
this, rachel, I think, is that
the majority of americans, black
and white, see that this
president is trying to do a good
job.
|
| 00:09:31 | They're not going to play the
race baiting, and sarah palin on
saturday I heard her talk about
we don't want a professor of law
who talks about the constitution
and rights.
|
| 00:09:40 | We want the commander in chief.
|
| 00:09:41 | What's the difference?
|
| 00:09:43 | Isn't the law meaningful?
|
| 00:09:44 | Doesn't it mean something?
|
| 00:09:45 | Doesn't the constitution mean
something?
|
| 00:09:47 | I think we need to go back to a
101 constitutional law test or
civics test for folks who are
going to talk about that for
everybody to understand that we
are a society who believes in
equal justice under the law, one
person, one vote.
|
| 00:10:02 | If you get more than, more votes
than your opponent you win.
|
| 00:10:03 | It's over.
|
| 00:10:04 | Get over it and let's move
forward.
|
| 00:10:06 | >> You think we could have a
civics test for pundits and paid
political speakers but not for
voters?
|
| 00:10:11 | >> I think it's a little late
for tancredo.
|
| 00:10:16 | I think voters have already told
him he won't be in office again
and I think he helped the
republican party in some sense
by letting people see if that's
the extreme of what people are
talking about, most democrats,
most republicans are moderates.
|
| 00:10:29 | They're in the center.
|
| 00:10:32 | And tancredo is not going to get
our vote.
|
| 00:10:35 | Two points.
|
| 00:10:36 | One, ignore him or overwhelm him
with more speech that's
rational, sensible, that has
something to do with the
constitution, with laws, with
common sense, and all of that
was left out of his comments
this past weekend.
|
| 00:10:48 | >> I will tell you that my -- i
think people could tell on the
show on friday when I first
talked about this and I spent
the weekend reading up on the
history of the means by which
people were denied the right to
vote in this country and got
angrier and angrier about it.
|
| 00:10:59 | And I'm still mad about it now.
|
| 00:11:01 | I don't do my best work when I'm
mad but I criticized the
pancredo on
friday and the crowd response to
his speech as racist.
|
| 00:11:06 | That is not an epithet that i
use often and not something i
mean in an all purpose way.
|
| 00:11:10 | I mean it in a very specific
way.
|
| 00:11:13 | People react to that allegation
like you've thrown a bomb.
|
| 00:11:16 | Like there's no way to
constructively consider whether
a statement or proposal is
really racist.
|
| 00:11:22 | Are we less able to talk about
race and racism than we used to
be or have we always been this
hamstrung about it?
|
| 00:11:27 | >> I think we can talk about it
more than ever before because we
have a president who happens to
be black and so it's an open
dialogue and I'm glad we're
having it because I think
ultimately people will run out
of things to say about barack
obama about race.
|
| 00:11:40 | The question is does he have
good judgment?
|
| 00:11:42 | He moving the country forward?
|
| 00:11:44 | He dealing with the issue of the
economy?
|
| 00:11:48 | Is he trying to bring the
soldiers home from these wars?
|
| 00:11:51 | Is he trying to get people jobs?
|
| 00:11:53 | And then race becomes
irrelevant.
|
| 00:11:55 | I think that is the real key.
|
| 00:11:55 | Not whether we can talk about it
but whether we can agree to
disagree on certain things but
continue to have the dialogue as
well.
|
| 00:12:01 | Even thoughtful democrats and
thoughtful progressive people,
chris matthews, saying he forgot
barack obama was black, and
senator harry reid saying that
he didn't speak the negro
dialect, we need to do a lot of
sort of race 101 across the
political spectrum because it is
the most controversial issue.
|
| 00:12:18 | I'm teaching a class now at the
university of miami law school
with over 40 students from all
over the world and they
understand that we're not in a
a post racial america.
|
| 00:12:29 | We're in a very consciously race
america.
|
| 00:12:31 | And we're going to learn how to
make it a better place in the
21st century.
|
| 00:12:35 | >> Tom tancredo keeping us all
in 101 as far as I'm concerned
at this point.
|
| 00:12:39 | Professor charles ogletree, an
eminent scholar of these and
other matters, a real pleasure
to have you on the show.
|
| 00:12:47 | It's an honor to have you here,
sir.
|
| 00:12:48 | Thank you.
|
| 00:12:49 | >> Always my pleasure.
|
| 00:12:49 | >> Thank you.
|
| 00:12:50 | >>> If there is one candidate
you would think would get the
tea party seal of approval it
would be the guy who was tea
partying before tea partying was
cool.
|
| 00:12:59 | Arch big government hater ron
paul.
|
| 00:13:00 | Turns out, though, even ron paul
has now got primary challengers
getting tea partier than thou on
him.
|
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| 00:14:12 | >>> Republican party chairman
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|
| 00:14:21 | If the republican party ever
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democratic party should hire
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|
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| 00:16:14 | Hi
Hi
♪(whistling tune) ♪("Don't worry be happy")♪
|
| 00:17:05 | [ Crowd chanting ]
>>> supporters of congressman
ron paul back in december 2007,
celebrating the 234th
anniversary of the boston tea
party with rallies across the
nation and an online money bomb
that raised millions of dollars
for ron paul's presidential bid
in 2008.
|
| 00:17:33 | Congressman ron paul's candidacy
was arguably the spiritual
godfather of what's now become
the tea party movement.
|
| 00:17:40 | The current figurehead of the
movement arguably is sarah
palin.
|
| 00:17:44 | She's endorsed ron paul's son,
rand, who was open-minded enough
to make his senate campaign
announcement several months ago
on this very show.
|
| 00:17:53 | Rand paul, like his dad, is
philosophically a libertarian
but is running for office as a
republican.
|
| 00:17:59 | Weirdly, congressman ron paul,
himself, is now under attack
from the very movement that he
seemingly inspired.
|
| 00:18:06 | He's getting primaried in his
district in texas by not one,
not two, but three republican
challengers, all of whom have
associated themselves with the
tea party movement
by attending or organizing tea
party rallies.
|
| 00:18:21 | They are each apparently hoping
the anti-incumbent fervor of the
tea party movement will sweep
ron paul out of office.
|
| 00:18:27 | Yes, ron paul.
|
| 00:18:27 | The conservative candidate who
in 2008 was able to draw more
than 10,000 supporters away from
the republican national
convention with his libertarian
message to attend his own shadow
convention in minneapolis.
|
| 00:18:38 | He's now getting challenged by
the supposedly libertarian-
leaning conservatives that his
presidential candidacy inspired.
|
| 00:18:46 | If they're not cool with ron
paul, who are they cool with?
|
| 00:18:53 | Joining us now is dave weigel,
the senior reporter for "the
"
he reported on
this weekend's tea party
convention in nashville.
|
| 00:19:03 | David, it's very nice to see
you.
|
| 00:19:04 | Thanks for being here good to
see you.
|
| 00:19:06 | Thanks.
|
| 00:19:07 | >> Let me just ask you the last
question.
|
| 00:19:09 | If they're not cool with ron
paul who are they cool with?
|
| 00:19:11 | I would have expected it to be a
nice fit between the tea party
movement and mr. paul.
|
| 00:19:14 | >> He's never been a good fit
with these types of conservative
activists because of the war
issue.
|
| 00:19:20 | I kind of got misty-eyed looking
at the old tea party videos.
|
| 00:19:22 | I was at one in 2007 in
georgetown where a ron paul
activist put things like federal
reserve and unsound money on
boxes and then jumped and
smashed the boxes after they
threw them on the floor.
|
| 00:19:35 | So they really did invent all of
this stuff.
|
| 00:19:38 | But the tea party movement is
more one of like conservative
McCAIN, CONSERVATIVE PALIN
Voters who are conservative on
everything really that is main
stream the republican party.
|
| 00:19:44 | They're more like jim demint
than
>> well, one of most fun
things in all of american
politics for the past year has
been trying to figure out the
tea party movement, all this
incoherent anger and energy in
this
movement, trying to figure out
what it really means in
political terms.
|
| 00:20:07 | They do articulate their
grievances as if they are
libertarian grievances.
|
| 00:20:10 | But from your reporting, you're
seeing that really what they're
asking for is not libertarian
policies?
|
| 00:20:14 | >> Economic policy I think
they can attribute a little bit
from him.
|
| 00:20:21 | But it's revealing whenever
you hear the tea party movement
is completely independent and
completely one of populist anger
that leaves out they're really
pushing on an open door when it
comes to the republican party.
|
| 00:20:30 | There is very little they say
that the republican party
disagrees with in the
mainstream.
|
| 00:20:38 | Tom tancredo you played before,
he was at the convention after
he gave that speech and gave a
little pep talk to the room on
immigration policy and said,
hey, you know, you guys did this
really well before, back in 2006
you were melting the phones and
stopping congress from passing
immigration reform.
|
| 00:20:51 | Now, ron paul also happens to be
against immigration amnesty, but
those libertarian ideas that
might be popular at the cato
institute aren't popular with
tea party activists.
|
| 00:21:02 | They're much more hard core
conservatives who are really
comfortable in the republican
party.
|
| 00:21:07 | >> I feel where I'm getting to,
and I am fired up about the tom
tancredo call for the return to
literacy tests thing not so much
because he would do it because
he does stuff like that all the
time but that people would cheer
for it.
|
| 00:21:21 | I guess I see the choose ron
paul versus choose sarah palin
test as kind of the litmus test
for the politics of the tea
party movement.
|
| 00:21:29 | That combined with cheering
tancredo on this, I think, very
racist appeal makes me feel like
the modern tea party movement is
an outgrowth of the angry people
we saw frustrated during the
McCAIN/PALIN CAMPAIGN SAYING
Unpolitically correct things at
rallies.
|
| 00:21:47 | Not an outgrowth of the tea
parties before.
|
| 00:21:49 | >> Ron paul's movement, his
presidential campaign was always
much more positive and much more
about these -- this basket of
ideas that libertarians could
implement that would fix the
country.
|
| 00:22:02 | When he talked about getting
back not constitution, getting
back to the founders' vision, he
was talking
about getting american bases
shut down, pulling out of
foreign wars, abolishing social
security, things like that.
|
| 00:22:19 | The palin version of tea party
conservativism is a little bit
less specific.
|
| 00:22:22 | It's a lot more slogany.
|
| 00:22:25 | It has -- you know, I guess you
could write the talking points
on your hand if you wanted to.
|
| 00:22:28 | And it's not so much about these
well thought out historical
solutions but there's a general
idea of the constitution, and it
just so happens to fit in with
things that the republican party
right now is very much into.
|
| 00:22:38 | So, yeah.
|
| 00:22:39 | There's less -- there are less
difficult choices there.
|
| 00:22:42 | >> Dave weigel is a senior
reporter for "the washington
"
thanks for your reporting on
this continually and thanks for
your time.
|
| 00:22:50 | Really appreciate it.
|
| 00:22:51 | >> Thank you so much.
|
| 00:22:52 | >>> As I said, rand paul has
been a guest on this show in the
past.
|
| 00:22:54 | Ron paul a number of times as
well.
|
| 00:22:55 | We're hoping to have congressman
ron paul on sometime soon to
respond to the fact that he's
getting more primary challengers
now from the tea party movement
than he's had any time recently
in congress from anyone.
|
| 00:23:05 | All right.
|
| 00:23:07 | >>> Conservative critics say
president obama is coddling
terror suspects by reading them
their rights.
|
| 00:23:13 | Those critics thereby blowing
their own right to remain
south on i-75, near exit 5.
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| 00:26:51 | >>> Twice in the last week or so
the top senate republican mitch
McCONNELL HAS UNFLATTERINGLY
Compared fbi agents
interrogating the christmas day
bomber to cnn's larry king.
|
| 00:27:04 | >> I mean larry king would have
a more thorough interrogation of
one of 4is witnesses than the
christmas bomber had by the
justice department.
|
| 00:27:15 | He was given a 50-minute
interrogation, probably larry
king has interrogated people
longer and better than that.
|
| 00:27:21 | >> Casting no aspersions
king, he
always seemed like a nice man
who is very good at his job, but
WHAT DOES mitch McConnell have
against the fbi?
|
| 00:27:31 | Has he got some specific beef
with the fbi that he's going to
take up in policy and
legislation?
|
| 00:27:36 | Or is he just going to keep
trashing fbi agents on
television for political effect?
|
| 00:27:41 | This is the kind of thing that
politicians usually end up
having to apologize for.
|
| 00:27:46 | So far despite making the same
crack twice in a five-day span,
there's been no apology yet.
|
| 00:27:50 | I would warn you to set a google
alert in anticipation but now
that an ally of president
obama's has said publicly that
mitch McConnell should apologize
to the fbi, I think we can be
PRETTY SURE THAT MR. McCONNELL
Will not apologize.
|
| 00:28:04 | >> Maybe if all those
politicians stopped attacking
THE FBI mitch McConnell likened
the fbi to larry king interview.
|
| 00:28:15 | Maybe if they'd stop with the
politics.
|
| 00:28:17 | >> Now that's cruel.
|
| 00:28:18 | >> No, I think he owes the fbi
an apology.
|
| 00:28:19 | >> Former clinton chief of staff
john podesta speaking there.
|
| 00:28:24 | He cochaired the obama/biden
transition team and is one of
many now pushing the gop in
public for getting so much
factually wrong.
|
| 00:28:30 | In the mad rush to politicize
the christmas day bombing to try
to hurt the president.
|
| 00:28:36 | >> Those fbi agents and others
acted appropriately.
|
| 00:28:39 | And quite frankly I'm tiring of
politicians using national
security issues such as
terrorism as a political
football.
|
| 00:28:45 | They are going out there.
|
| 00:28:47 | They are unknowing of the facts
and they're making charges and
allegations that are not
anchored in reality.
|
| 00:28:51 | On christmas night I called a
number of senior members of
congress.
|
| 00:28:55 | I SPOKE TO senators McConnell
and bond.
|
| 00:28:58 | I spoke to representative
boehner and hoekstra.
|
| 00:29:00 | I explained to them that he was
in fbi custody, that
abdulmutallab was in fact
that he was cooperating at that
point.
|
| 00:29:08 | They knew that in fbi custody
means there is a process you
follow as far as mirandizing and
presenting him in front after
of a imagine strai strat.
|
| 00:29:20 | None of those individuals raised
any concerns with me at that
point.
|
| 00:29:22 | They didn't say is he going into
military custody?
|
| 00:29:25 | Is he going to be mirandized?
|
| 00:29:27 | >> That was white house
counterterrorism expert speaking
"
senator bond has said he didn't
understand a person in custody
would naturally and as a matter
of course be read their rights.
|
| 00:29:40 | Senator bond I should note here
is actually a united states
senator.
|
| 00:29:44 | The former counterterrorism
adviser to president bush and
president clinton before him,
richard clarke also attacking
the gop now for not grasping
even the basic facts of how
terrorism arrests and
prosecutions work but still
trying to use them to score
political points.
|
| 00:29:56 | clarke writing in "the new
york daily news," quote, recent
months have seen the party out
of power picking fights over the
conduct of our efforts against
al qaeda, often with total
disregard for the facts.
|
| 00:30:09 | It's been hard to escape the
conclusion that the goal of
these critics is to discredit
the president's handling of
terrorism for political
advantage whether or not the
administration is actually doing
a good job.
|
| 00:30:19 | The gop talking point machine
repeated by fox television
commentators and others does not
bother to learn the facts about
terrorism before they leap to
attacking the party in power's
handling of the issue.
|
| 00:30:26 | They are wrong on the facts and
they are wrong morally to
attempt to make political gain
on the damage inflicted by
terrorism.
|
| 00:30:36 | bush and
bill clinton counterterrorism
adviser richard clarke.
|
| 00:30:39 | Unless there be any doubt that
the administration realizes that
on this issue of terrorism it
has caught its republican
critics in the act of making
stuff up and attacking their own
policies, the president,
himself, is going there.
|
| 00:30:53 | Here he was at a presuper bowl
interview on cbs.
|
| 00:30:56 | >> We're not handling any of
these cases any different than
the bush administration handled
them all through 9/11.
|
| 00:31:06 | They prosecuted 190 folks in
these article iii courts, got
convictions, and those folks are
in maximum security prisons
right now and there have been no
escapes and it is a virtue of
our system that we should be
proud of.
|
| 00:31:23 | Some of the same critics of our
approach have been employing
this policy for years.
|
| 00:31:29 | >> Joining us now is nbc's chief
foreign affairs correspondent
andrea mitchell.
|
| 00:31:34 | Thank you so much for coming
back on the show tonight and
braving the snow to do so.
|
| 00:31:36 | >> You bet.
|
| 00:31:37 | No problem.
|
| 00:31:39 | >> Does it just feel like the
administration and its allies
are firing back hard against
these attacks about the
christmas day bomber or is this
really a concerted effort?
|
| 00:31:47 | Am I connecting the appropriate
do here?
|
| 00:31:50 | >> I think what's going on is
that right after the
massachusetts senate defeat for
the democrats republicans
realized they had a really good
issue.
|
| 00:31:59 | The number one issue that scott
brown mentioned in massachusetts
was terror.
|
| 00:32:04 | It was terror, taxes, then
health care.
|
| 00:32:06 | And I think they realized that
they've got something going here
and the administration has
almost played into their hands
with a series of steps that were
not really well explained.
|
| 00:32:16 | And I think that is part of the
problem.
|
| 00:32:18 | Part of the problem is it was
christmas.
|
| 00:32:21 | People were given a two-minute
briefing and in kind of a
parallel world to the largely
inadequate bush administration
briefings that we know about to
members of congress, democratic
members of congress back then, i
think they didn't want to tell
very much nor did they want to
go into a whole lot of detail
nor was anyone really eagerly
looking for information at that
time partly because let's face
it they were not on secure
lines.
|
| 00:32:46 | Everyone was out of pocket.
|
| 00:32:48 | So this was a series of steps,
accidents waiting to happen,
where nobody was in a position
where they could go to a secure
room.
|
| 00:32:54 | Nobody was in washington.
|
| 00:32:57 | So part of it is accidental,
coincidental.
|
| 00:32:59 | Part of it is deliberate because
the republicans now smell blood.
|
| 00:33:03 | And the democrats certainly this
white house has not been very
good at explaining.
|
| 00:33:07 | You have this very unusual
situation on "meet the press"
where john brennan, a career
intelligence official -- we
don't know what political stripe
he has if any.
|
| 00:33:19 | He actually went after
republicans on the hill, people
who might some day have to be
confirming him if he were not in
the white house and had a
confirmable nomination, and you
don't normally see this.
|
| 00:33:29 | This is a career guy who has
worked in democratic and
republican administrations at
the cia and other places, and
that was pretty unusual.
|
| 00:33:44 | Markis I isikoff were talking
about this earlier today.
|
| 00:33:49 | A very unusual step for them to
take.
|
| 00:33:51 | They feel that they have been
maligned, misunderstood, and are
being criticized for exactly
what the bush administration
did.
|
| 00:33:56 | >> You seemed last week on your
show here on msnbc, we played
the clip of your interaction
with senator susan collins of
maine talking about this issue
and you seemed to somewhat sort
of flabbergast her when you
pointed out the procedures the
obama administration followed
now are the same the bush
administration used in lots of
other terrorism cases.
|
| 00:34:10 | I wonder if that sort of
fact-based confrontation is
pushing republicans to have to
consciously position themselves
as to the right of bush and
cheney on terrorism now.
|
| 00:34:22 | >> Well, what they are arguing
is that they should have been
briefed, number one, that this
interrogation was not handled
properly.
|
| 00:34:28 | And in fact, they
were given a little bit of a
window there because dennis
blair, the head of the director
of national intelligence
initially criticized the fbi for
the way they handled it and then
backed off that criticism.
|
| 00:34:39 | So there were a series of
confusing signals from the
administration, itself,
indicating that there had been
some mistakes made in this case.
|
| 00:34:47 | What they are now saying, the
administration, is that there
was 50 minutes of questioning,
then they took him for medical
care, and it was then that he
clammed up and eventually had to
be given his rights because he
had been arrested here in the
united states.
|
| 00:35:05 | There's plenty of evidence --
jane mayer, our colleague and
friend, documents it brilliantly
in "the new yorker" this week,
plenty of evidence that there
was a better track record with
these civilian cases than with
military commissions for people
arrested during all of the bush
years.
|
| 00:35:19 | So there's no question that they
have gotten very good
information.
|
| 00:35:22 | And I think the other
frusting thing for the
administration is they have not
gotten out there just how
cleverly they flew to nigeria
after first blowing it when the
father came in and went to the
embassy and tried to talk about
his son and, clearly, the agent
on duty, the embassy officials
probably all the way up to the
ambassador did not pick up on
those signals.
|
| 00:35:44 | So he should not have been on
the fly list.
|
| 00:35:45 | He should have been stopped.
|
| 00:35:50 | He should -- his visa and access
should have been checked way
earlier.
|
| 00:35:53 | Those mistakes have been
acknowledged.
|
| 00:35:54 | But then they went to nigeria,
got the family involved, flew
the family to detroit, and
persuaded him to start talking
and started getting very good
actionable intelligence, they
tell us.
|
| 00:36:05 | And so they're kind of angry
that they're not getting credit
for that.
|
| 00:36:10 | One other thing, rachel.
|
| 00:36:12 | I think this has been a perfect
storm for the administration
because they really did not
properly handle the 9/11 terror
trial proposal for new york
city.
|
| 00:36:19 | They didn't notify the mayor,
the police chief properly.
|
| 00:36:21 | They didn't work with the
families.
|
| 00:36:22 | They didn't lay the ground work
for that for bringing khalid
sheikh mohammed to new york
city.
|
| 00:36:37 | It's two things merged in
people's mind, people like sarah
palin who accuse the
president of being soft on
terror.
|
| 00:36:45 | >> Andrea mitchell, thanks very
much again for joining us
tonight.
|
| 00:36:47 | Appreciate it.
|
| 00:36:48 | >> You bet.
|
| 00:36:49 | >> Watch andrea mitchell every
day on msnbc at 1:00 p.m.
|
| 00:36:51 | Eastern.
|
| 00:36:52 | Okay.
|
| 00:36:53 | >>> Still ahead michael steele
shares his concept of wealth,
which is every bit as michael
steele as all of his other
ideas.
|
| 00:36:59 | It's beautiful.
|
| 00:36:59 | Stay with us.
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| 00:39:39 | >>> The latest republican
solution for the budget crunch?
|
| 00:39:43 | Weaning.
|
| 00:39:48 | And the rachel maddow show does
new orleans.
|
| 00:39:49 | Exclusive video of pure joy
straight ahead.
|
| 00:39:51 | First a couple holy mackerel
stories.
|
| 00:39:55 | Beginning with what happens if
health reform doesn't pass?
|
| 00:39:58 | First of course a whole lot of
democrats who have jobs in
politics lose those jobs.
|
| 00:40:04 | Also the american economy keels
over and dies.
|
| 00:40:07 | A nonpartisan accounting agency
the center for medicare and
medicaid services was tasked
with crunching the numbers for
what we spend on health care.
|
| 00:40:17 | What ne they came up with is a
kick in the teeth.
|
| 00:40:22 | Last year health care spending
grew more than it ever has since
the government started keeping
track of such things 50 years
ago.
|
| 00:40:25 | It grew by $134 billion.
|
| 00:40:27 | That's the way things have been
going since 1960.
|
| 00:40:33 | Up, up, up and up, most
dramatically now.
|
| 00:40:36 | In 1960 health care spending was
a grand total of about 5% of our
gdp.
|
| 00:40:39 | By 1970 up to about 7%.
|
| 00:40:41 | By 1980, 9% of all the dollars
we spent went to health care.
|
| 00:40:45 | By 1990 it was up to 12%.
|
| 00:40:47 | By 2000 almost 14%.
|
| 00:40:49 | And by last year our health care
spending constituted more than
17% of our entire economic
output as americans.
|
| 00:41:00 | We now spend one out of every $6
in our entire economy on health
care.
|
| 00:41:05 | In ten years it's projected to
be one in $5.
|
| 00:41:06 | Not one in six.
|
| 00:41:08 | One of every $5 we spend in our
whole economy will be spent just
on our own health care.
|
| 00:41:12 | And that's with not even
covering everyone.
|
| 00:41:15 | Other industrialized countries
cover everyone and have actual
systems which control costs.
|
| 00:41:21 | The uk for example while not a
perfect system is a full
nationalized health system that
covers everyone.
|
| 00:41:26 | For that they spend 7% of their
gdp.
|
| 00:41:29 | We have no system.
|
| 00:41:30 | No way to control costs.
|
| 00:41:33 | And our health spending is 17%
of our economy and growing.
|
| 00:41:38 | That's why reforming health
care -- having an actual
american health care system with
cost controls, is a fiscally
responsible thing to do.
|
| 00:41:51 | Or I think we could all agree
it's at least fiscally insane
not to do it.
|
| 00:41:54 | Case in point?
|
| 00:41:55 | One california insurance company
anthem blue cross notified
individual policy holders last
week their premiums would be
going up by as much as 39% this
year.
|
| 00:42:03 | That's on top of an increase of
premiums last year of as much as
68%.
|
| 00:42:07 | Unlike home and car insurance
health insurance companies
legally can jack up their rates
whenever they want for as much
as they want.
|
| 00:42:14 | But a rate increase this
outrageous has attracted an
investigation from the
california insurance
commissioner.
|
| 00:42:18 | Health and human services
secretary kathleen sebelius is
has also sent a letter to
anthem blue cross asking them to
justify the hikes.
|
| 00:42:27 | The company says it will respond
once it receives the secretary's
letter.
|
| 00:42:30 | Our calls to the company today
were not returned.
|
| 00:42:32 | Perhaps they anticipated our
planned questions about the
timing of the rate hike.
|
| 00:42:36 | Anthem blue cross announced the
second consecutive double digit
rate hike right after announcing
an eight fold increase in profit
last quarter.
|
| 00:42:45 | We eagerly await whatever
conceivable explanation they can
come up with for this.
|
| 00:42:50 | We also eagerly await health
reform.
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| 00:44:56 | >>> 106 Million people watch the
super bowl on tv.
|
| 00:45:00 | Kent jones watched it on tv in a
bar in new orleans.
|
| 00:45:03 | With a camera on the crowd.
|
| 00:45:04 | It was an experience he
describes as historically
insane.
|
| 00:45:08 | Stay tuned for that.
|
| 00:46:43 | >>> In a face-to-face recent
appearance with former
congressman harold ford, the
republican party chairman
michael steele was attacking
president obama's decision to
let the bush tax cuts expire for
the top 2% of earners.
|
| 00:46:56 | Mr. steele then said this.
|
| 00:46:58 | Quote, trust me, after taxes, a
million dollars is not a lot of
money.
|
| 00:47:03 | The 98% of americans who make
less than $250,000 a year will
be interested to learn that from
the republican party chairman.
|
| 00:47:12 | Of further interest to those
people will be the republican
new/old proposal for social
security.
|
| 00:47:15 | The ranking republican on the
house budget committee paul ryan
of wisconsin is now reproposing
president bush's 2005 proposal
president bush's 2005 proposal
to privatize social security.
|
| 00:47:27 | Which would I got to tell you be
a great idea if the stock market
always went up.
|
| 00:47:30 | Does the stock market always go
up?
|
| 00:47:33 | Meanwhile, congresswoman
michele bachman this weekend
offered this idea about social
security and said, quote,
basically what we have to do is
wean everybody else off.
|
| 00:47:43 | And wean everybody off because
we have to take those unfunded
net liabilities off our bank
sheet.
|
| 00:47:47 | We can't do it.
|
| 00:47:49 | So we just have to be straight
with people.
|
| 00:47:53 | Will there be wean panels to
decide who starves in poverty
and who survives?
|
| 00:47:58 | Democrats have now had the
bright idea of forcing
republicans to actually vote on
these republican proposals.
|
| 00:48:04 | Pass popcorn, hide grandma.
|
| 00:48:06 | Joining us now is democratic
congressman anthony weiner.
|
| 00:48:12 | Congressman, thanks for coming
back on the show.
|
| 00:48:13 | >> Thank you.
|
| 00:48:15 | Is this what they meant about
weaned, you get wiener proposal?
|
| 00:48:21 | >> You were teased on the play
yard.
|
| 00:48:23 | I feel like we're having a
flashback to the way we first
met, which is you forcing
republicans to take an awkward
vote on killing medicare.
|
| 00:48:30 | Is this the same kind of
politics?
|
| 00:48:31 | >> Yes, but this is to the nth
degree.
|
| 00:48:36 | ryan's proposals represent
the republican budget proposals.
|
| 00:48:40 | This is the way they propose to
this handle the challenges that
we face.
|
| 00:48:45 | At least they're coming out from
where they're hiding, we're
against social security, we want
to privatize it, against
medicare, want to give people
vouchers.
|
| 00:48:53 | So a third of the vouchers go to
health insurance company profits
rather than health care.
|
| 00:48:57 | I think they should have to
answer and I think the president
did a smart thing by taking
these see seriously.
|
| 00:49:03 | I think they make no sense and
most people who get the benefits
will say that they don't.
|
| 00:49:07 | But they represent the
republican mainstream thinking.
|
| 00:49:09 | This is not a fringe movement.
|
| 00:49:11 | This is what the budget
committee ranking member says he
wants to do.
|
| 00:49:15 | >> It seems like the political
maneuver is to say however you
think the president is doing
under president obama and
democratic majorities, that's
one thing.
|
| 00:49:24 | This isn't a referendum on that.
|
| 00:49:26 | This is a choice between the
democrats are offering and what
the republicans.
|
| 00:49:33 | That leaves it to the democrats.
|
| 00:49:35 | >> Remember what we did.
|
| 00:49:37 | We went through eight years
where arguably a lot of the
decisions were not made.
|
| 00:49:40 | We were funding things without
paying for them.
|
| 00:49:42 | Then we went into a campaign
where the president said to his
credit and democrats said we're
going to treat this like adults,
make tough decisions.
|
| 00:49:49 | A lot of them are unpopular.
|
| 00:49:51 | Now at least we're not going to
be boxing with ourselves against
the idea.
|
| 00:49:54 | We're going to talk about other
people's proposals and I think
the republicans will have to
decide.
|
| 00:49:59 | I can't wait to see if the
republicans vote for these
republican proposals, because i
can't imagine that there's a
majority of them or a large
number of them that believes in
the notion that if we invest in
the social security trust fund
in the stock market that this we
would be a lot better off.
|
| 00:50:12 | >> Especially given what we've
been through.
|
| 00:50:15 | Congressman ryan says he's
willing to lose his job over his
ideas.
|
| 00:50:18 | He sees this as a position of
political bravery.
|
| 00:50:22 | Is there a libertarian no
government streak in the
republican party that is where
they might get a lot of votes
for this?
|
| 00:50:29 | >> Republicans never liked
social security and they have
been trying to do this type of
thing for a while.
|
| 00:50:33 | The same is true of medicare.
|
| 00:50:35 | There's something implicit in
this whole conversation about
the fear of government-run
health care that logically
extended means you don't like
medicare.
|
| 00:50:41 | But what they can't get away
with any longer is criticizing
democrats for attacking medicare
when we're trying to save it or
say they're the more responsible
protecters of the interest of
taxpayers when they want to
invest large amounts of our
trust fund in the stock market.
|
| 00:50:57 | They can't get away with it
anymore.
|
| 00:50:59 | >> One last question on a
totally different matter.
|
| 00:51:02 | In congressman john murtha
passed away today.
|
| 00:51:04 | I know you knew him very well.
|
| 00:51:07 | Do you have any reflections on
his paging?
|
| 00:51:09 | >> A remarkable man, if you
think about recent americans
'civic life had a remarkable
influence.
|
| 00:51:14 | He was a hawk, someone who is
the defense appropriations
chairman who came out relatively
early on and said the iraq war
was a mistake and wasn't
working.
|
| 00:51:23 | He automatically overnight
changed the debate.
|
| 00:51:26 | Beyond that, he was someone from
a different era who was a
genuinely nice, decent man.
|
| 00:51:31 | It was hard to find anyone in
congress who didn't love and
admire him.
|
| 00:51:35 | I'm going to miss him very much.
|
| 00:51:36 | >> Good to see you.
|
| 00:51:37 | >>> Coming up on "countdown,"
keith talks to harry shearer
about the importance of the
saints win for new orleans.
|
| 00:51:45 | Kent jones was in new orleans
for the game and the massive
party that ensued afterwards
still ringing in kent's head
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|
| 00:52:18 | hey!
|
| 00:52:18 | hey!
|
| 00:52:18 | I was just in town
for a few days,
and I was wondering if I could
say hi to the doctor.
|
| 00:52:21 | Is he in?
|
| 00:52:22 | He's in copenhagen.
|
| 00:52:22 | Oh, well, that's nice.
|
| 00:52:23 | But you can still see him!
|
| 00:52:24 | You just said
..
|
| 00:52:25 | Copenhagen.
|
| 00:52:27 | Come on!
|
| 00:52:28 | That's pretty far.
|
| 00:52:30 | Doc, look who's in town.
|
| 00:52:32 | Ellen!
|
| 00:52:33 | Copenhagen?
|
| 00:52:33 | Cool, right?
|
| 00:52:35 | Vacation.
|
| 00:52:35 | But still
seeing patients.
|
| 00:52:36 | Oh.
|
| 00:52:37 | [ whispering ]
Workaholic.
|
| 00:52:38 | I heard that.
|
| 00:52:39 | She said it.
|
| 00:52:40 | ..
|
| 00:52:40 | [ Female Announcer ]
The new office.
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| 00:52:42 | See it. live it.
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| 00:52:43 | Share it.
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| 00:52:44 | On the human network.
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| 00:55:05 | >>> We did something
uncharacteristic on this show.
|
| 00:55:07 | On friday night we went all the
way to new orleans because of
this super bowl.
|
| 00:55:11 | As it turned out, super bowl was
the most watched show in
television history.
|
| 00:55:20 | Bigger nan the finale of masche.
|
| 00:55:25 | 65 Million people tuned in to
watch the colts, but not all
5 million people had the same
experience.
|
| 00:55:32 | Our own kent jeauxnse made the
life affirming experience to
stay in new orleans to watch the
game with the who dat nation.
|
| 00:55:38 | Kent, you win!
|
| 00:55:40 | >> You said the words
historically insane earlier.
|
| 00:55:44 | It was!
|
| 00:55:45 | It so was.
|
| 00:55:46 | I was in this incredibly packed
bar in the french quarter called
one-eyed jacks.
|
| 00:55:52 | The place went off.
|
| 00:55:54 | Unbelievable 40 years of
frustration gone.
|
| 00:55:56 | And then they started cranking
acdc's "it's a long way to the
top if you want to rock 'n
roll," which I did clearly.
|
| 00:56:03 | People were dancing and
screaming "who dat," and that
was just me.
|
| 00:56:07 | Unbelievable!
|
| 00:56:10 | Then everybody pointed out on
the street, and we squeezed our
way into bourbon street.
|
| 00:56:16 | More screaming, high-fiving
stranger, who dat, who dat.
|
| 00:56:20 | Music going absolutely
everywhere.
|
| 00:56:22 | Total mayhem for a long way in
the distance.
|
| 00:56:26 | But I did get to actually talk
to some really happy who dats
afterwards.
|
| 00:56:32 | Really happy.
|
| 00:56:33 | >> I've been here since '84,
been born and raised here.
|
| 00:56:35 | This means everything!
|
| 00:56:36 | >> This is incredible.
|
| 00:56:42 | It's not your daddy's saints.
|
| 00:56:42 | Super bowl champs.
|
| 00:56:43 | [ Cheering ]
>> this whole town has been
behind this team.
|
| 00:56:50 | >> It's better than mardi gras.
|
| 00:56:52 | This is the saints' mardi gras.
|
| 00:56:53 | >> When are you going back to
work, like maybe march?
|
| 00:56:58 | >> No, april.
|
| 00:57:00 | >> We call this the scream
umbrella.
|
| 00:57:02 | Ready?
|
| 00:57:02 | One, two, three!
|
| 00:57:04 | >> All of this is amazing that
it happened during mardi gras.
|
| 00:57:09 | >> That's like the regularly
scheduled craziness.
|
| 00:57:11 | So they had that too, like this,
right?
|
| 00:57:13 | The incredible floats and people
are throwing beads, and there is
likelihooded riders, and this
incredible costumes that they
have.
|
| 00:57:21 | And there I am trying to get
beads because I need beads.
|
| 00:57:24 | That's the thing I need.
|
| 00:57:26 | Throw me plastic stuff.
|
| 00:57:27 | And then there was a dog mardi
gras that I went to.
|
| 00:57:30 | Lots of saints outfits.
|
| 00:57:33 | The crew of barkus.
|
| 00:57:35 | And then here is what happened.
|
| 00:57:36 | I got slobbered on.
|
| 00:57:39 | Oh, yeah, dog slobber!
|
| 00:57:41 | So obviously a wonderful, great
time.
|
| 00:57:43 | There was actually a dog there
called pooh brees.
|
| 00:57:53 | New orleans does absolutely
everything.
|
| 00:57:55 | They're just having so much fun
with it.
|
| 00:57:56 | My favorite guy was this guy,
and he called himself -- breesu
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| 00:44:19 | Hi, may I help you?
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| 00:44:20 | Yes, I hear
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| 00:52:45 | guest
page.
|
| 00:52:47 | Hi, ellen!
|
| 00:52:48 | Hi, ellen!
|
| 00:52:48 | Hi, ellen!
|
| 00:52:48 | Hi, ellen!
|
| 00:52:49 | We're going on a field trip
to china!
|
| 00:52:51 | WOW. [ chuckles ]
When I was a kid, we --
we would just go
to the -- the farm.
|
| 00:52:56 | [ cow moos ]
[ laughter ]
No, seriously,
where are you guys going?
|
| 00:53:01 | Ni hao!
|
| 00:53:02 | Ni hao!
|
| 00:53:02 | Ni hao!
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| 00:53:02 | Ni hao!
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| 00:53:06 | Ni hao!
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| 00:53:07 | [ Female Announcer ]
The new classroom.
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| 00:53:09 | See it. live it.
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| 00:53:09 | Share it.
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| 00:53:11 | On the human network.
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| 00:53:12 | Cisco.
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